>Let's either demand these things from both sides or from neither. Just because your experience matches one side, doesn't mean that experiences different from yours should require a higher degree of scrutiny.
Sort of.
The people that are happy with it and praising the avenues offered by LLM/AI solutions are creating codebases that fulfill their requirements, whatever those might be.
The people that seem to be unhappy with it tend to have the universal complaints of either "it produces garbage" , or "I'm slower with it.".
Maybe i'm showing my age here, but I remember these same exact discussions between people that either praised or disparaged search engines. The alternative being an internet Yellowpages (which was a thing for many years.)
The ones that praised it tended to be people who were taught or otherwise figured out how to use metadata tags like date:/onsite: , whereas the ones that disparaged it tended to be the folks who would search for things like "who won the game" and then proceed to click every scam/porno link on this green Earth and then blame Google/gdg/lycos/whatever when they were exposed to whatever they clicked.
in other words : proof is kind of in the pudding.
I wouldn't care about the compiler logs from a user that ignored all syntax and grammar rules of a language after picking it up last week, either -- but it's useful for successful devs to share their experiences both good and bad.
I care more about the opinions of those that know the rules of the game -- let the actual teams behind these software deal with the user testing and feedback from people that don't want to learn conventions.
> The people that are happy with it and praising the avenues offered by LLM/AI solutions are creating codebases that fulfill their requirements, whatever those might be.
Ah, but "whatever those might be" is the crucial bit.
I don't entirely disagree with what you're saying. There will always be a segment of power users who are able to leverage their knowledge about these tools to extract more value out of them than people who don't use them to their full potential. That is true for any tool, not just in software.
What you're ignoring are two other possibilities:
1. The expectation of users can be wildly different. Someone who has never programmed before, but can now create and ship a smartphone app, will see these tools as magical. Whatever issues they have will either go unnoticed, or won't matter considering the big picture. Surely their impression of AI tooling will be nothing short of positive. They might be experts at using LLMs, but not at programming.
OTOH, someone who has been programming for decades, and strives for a certain level of quality in their work, will find the experience much different. They will be able to see the flaws and limitations of these tools, and addressing them will take time and effort that they could've better spent elsewhere. As we've known since the introduction of LLMs, domain experts are the only ones who can experience these problems.
So the experience of both sides is valid, and should have equal weight in conversations. Unlike you, I do trust the opinion of domain experts over those of user experts, but that's a personal bias.
2. There are actual flaws and limitations in AI tooling. The assumption that all negative experiences are from users who are "holding it wrong", while all positive ones are from expert users, is wrong. It steers the conversation away from issues with the tech that should be discussed and addressed. And considering the industry is strongly propelled by hype and marketing right now, we need conversations grounded in reality to push back against it.
> The assumption that all negative experiences are from users who are "holding it wrong", while all positive ones are from expert users, is wrong.
I’m not sure about that. I feel like someone experienced would realize when using the LLM is a better idea than doing it themselves, and when they just need to do it by hand.
You might work in a situation where you have to do everything by hand, but then your response would be to the extent that you can see how it’s useful to other people.
> The ones that praised it tended to be people who were taught or otherwise figured out how to use metadata tags like date:/onsite: , whereas the ones that disparaged it tended to be the folks who would search for things like "who won the game" and then proceed to click every scam/porno link on this green Earth and then blame Google/gdg/lycos/whatever when they were exposed to whatever they clicked.
One big warning here: search engines only became really useful when you could search for "who won the game" and the search engine actually returned the correct thing as the top result.
We're more than a quarter of a century later and probably 99.99% of users don't know about Google's advanced search operators.
This should be a major warning for LLMs. People are people and will do people things.
Sort of.
The people that are happy with it and praising the avenues offered by LLM/AI solutions are creating codebases that fulfill their requirements, whatever those might be.
The people that seem to be unhappy with it tend to have the universal complaints of either "it produces garbage" , or "I'm slower with it.".
Maybe i'm showing my age here, but I remember these same exact discussions between people that either praised or disparaged search engines. The alternative being an internet Yellowpages (which was a thing for many years.)
The ones that praised it tended to be people who were taught or otherwise figured out how to use metadata tags like date:/onsite: , whereas the ones that disparaged it tended to be the folks who would search for things like "who won the game" and then proceed to click every scam/porno link on this green Earth and then blame Google/gdg/lycos/whatever when they were exposed to whatever they clicked.
in other words : proof is kind of in the pudding.
I wouldn't care about the compiler logs from a user that ignored all syntax and grammar rules of a language after picking it up last week, either -- but it's useful for successful devs to share their experiences both good and bad.
I care more about the opinions of those that know the rules of the game -- let the actual teams behind these software deal with the user testing and feedback from people that don't want to learn conventions.